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Why advertise a 4 yo BLM mare to beginners?


Der! Because every. single. experienced. rider. KNOWS she ain’t worth $2300!

sweet 4 year old BLM registere mustang mare, Well my client that has her mustang mare in training with me would like to sell her, she would like to find that forever home for her. She is a true buckskin with black legs, she has a star strip and snip of whit on her face, her name is “MEADOW” she has a true mustang head a Roman nose looks like a ANDALUSAN head. Meadow is 15hh or so about 1300 lbs look like she may have some draft in her she is heavy boned and has awesome feet no need for shoes. She is current on vaccines, wormer and teeth, she ties, bathes even lets you wash her face, she trailers, saddles & stands for mounting, she has been in my care for 3 weeks for tune up, & evaluation of what she knows, she lunges, when riding her she walk, trots and is learning to canter, I have taken her on some trails and she is great very curious and not spooky, she is learning to go through water. After Evaluating her I feel she would be a great trail horse for an Advanced beginner/ intermediate person, only because of her age she is still learning left right with her bit but catches on fast I feel she would make a great trail horse as her footing is awesome she is wel balanced, she would make a great ranch horse. video and photos http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tSf5cRz7t4&feature=colike Client is Asking $2300 MAKE OFFER”

Honestly, $230 would be a more appropriate price tag for this mare.

I do so love that a self proclaimed “trainer” is touting the fact that the mare “even lets you wash her face”.  Lets?  REALLY?!  Good gawd.  The trainer then goes on to say that she feels the mare would be suitable for an “advanced beginner/intermediate”… well she says person but I’m going to assume she meant rider because, honestly, what’s an advanced beginner person? Someone who can walk down the street without a helmet and full body bubble wrap armor? (Purposefully misunderstanding people can be fun!  Come on, just picture the advanced beginner person!! teehee)  A 4 YEAR OLD HORSE IS NEVER -sorry, that wasn’t enough emphasis – NEVER a beginner’s mount!  NEVER!  Not ever! I mean, come on! “she is still learning left right with her bit“.  What. The. Fraggle rock.

Ok, now watch the video and then we’ll chat.

Or, for the wonderful reader who emailed me to say she couldn’t access the videos, click here! 🙂

Did anyone else notice the too small circles the rider (presumably the trainer?) kept the mare on?  Both while lunging and riding?  Hmm, could that have been to keep the mare from getting too quick, jumping around, or any other 4 year old type behavior that would not suit a beginner rider?  If that is the trainer in the video – we need to have a chat about your methodology.  When lunging a young horse, do not back away from it.  It is for the horse to move out of your safety bubble, not the other way around.  Do not rush the horse out away from you in that manner – what do you think will happen when the beginner who buys her, because they don’t know any better, goes to lunge her for the first time?  The poor mare is going to go charging out on the lunge, as you have taught her, and the beginner isn’t going to know what to do! And did anyone else think the mare looked a bit off at times?  Although I suppose we could chalk that up to the too tight circles she was being forced to run around on, placing undue stress on her young, developing joints…

Ok, we’ve moved past the lunging and are now putting the saddle on.  This isn’t a commentary on the horse or her suitability (or lack thereof) as a beginner mount, but what the fuck is that person thinking tightening the cinch in that manner? (See approximately 3:30 of the video.)  You have a nice young mare that’s standing almost perfectly still for you to saddle her and then you go and do something that will sooner or later make her sour?  WAY TO GO GENIUS!  (On a side note: LEAVE THE FANCY CAMERA-WORK TO THE PROs! Scorcese, you are not.)  Honestly, who tightens a cinch like that?!

And then: the riding.  There were times during the video when it looked like the mare was getting a little speed on her, then the rider would circle.  Not a proper circle, mind you, more of an oval as the mare fell through her outside shoulder.  I know, I know, it’s a sales video, not a training one… But I’d rather see how a young horse takes and responds to a correction than have something go unchecked! -I guess that, again, is why they’re marketing to beginners… ARGH!!!!! Who saw the Wolverine movie? You know when Hugh Jackman falls to his knees and screams at the heavens?  THAT’S WHAT I FEEL LIKE DOING!!!!!

Honestly, what do y’all think? Is this a decent sales video? Or would you prefer to see some corrections?  Was the lunging as bad as I thought it was? Or did someone piss in my cornflakes again?

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About snarkyrider

We're snarktastic

Posted on April 5, 2012, in Bad Horse Ads, Bad Riders, Misc Horsies and tagged , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 47 Comments.

  1. ‘Looks like an Andalusian head’ – looks like a common, drafty head.

    Lunging in too tight a circle. Direct reining in a bit with huge shanks…at this stage in her training shouldn’t she be in a snaffle? I’m not a western person, but…

    And AGAIN WITH THE LOOSE DOGS. (Sorry, but why is it dodgy horse trainers always have loose, untrained dogs in the arena while working with their horse).

    That said, although I agree that she’s probably not worth the price being asked, she is a very nicely put together horse (I personally will take an ugly head if everything else is good…a nice head is nice, but its a bonus like a nice color…and she has a nice color, so…)

    • I agree with you! I think she is a NICE mare that probably has a lot of potential in a variety of areas if someone buys her that is experienced with finishing a horse. Sadly, I fear that will not happen here. I’m not a mustang fan in general, as most people know, but this one isn’t a conformational train wreck. She’s quite nice and should stay sound for a lot of good, hard work. She isn’t fancy but she’s built to last.

      To me, the longeing was typical NH-ey longeing – the horse was crowding the handler, allowed to rush out, clearly has not been taught to longe AT A WALK (pet peeve of mine), kept on too small a circle, person holding the line didn’t stay in one place to GIVE the mare a consistent circle.

  2. Did anyone else notice the limping Boxer during the “lunging” portion of the video? Now, I realize there may be a legitimate reason why the dog has a limp, and it’s possible the dog has received all reasonable veterinary care, but let’s just say I have my doubts.

    Good news is that any beginner who gets on that horse will be terrified during the “test ride” (let’s hope they do one?) and won’t buy it.

    The lunging is crap. When I hear “the horse can lunge,” I assume that we mean the horse can w/t/c and halt on command (maybe not PERFECT, but at least the basic idea of those commands). It doesn’t take a lot to tie a rope on the horse and shake a whip at it…

    They say she’s a good trail horse… I’m confused as to how you navigate trails when you admit your horse has no steering? Sounds like a fun time in the woods to me!

  3. WOW..You pretty much hit the nail on the head. Thank goodness she really does seem to be pretty good natred, but begineer horse? Uh no. And look where they have her tied! Ti a tree, “up high”…well not high enough that if she were to spokk and rear up, well either the tree would get busted or more likely and worse, she would knock herself out. Folks, if you are going to tie like this, then make sure that the limb is high enough that the horse cant hit its head. But off course, that probably wasnt even a thought in this “trainers” head. I wished I could buy her, for $230, and give her a good home, but I am responisible and just cant. She looks like she will make a decent horse, one day, with more training. Where I live 2300 bucks can get you a very broke horse that can babysit and be honest all day long.

  4. I gotta disagree with you – 4 year olds can absolutely make a good begginer’s horse – IF the horse AND rider are in a good training program!

    • and IF it’s a well mannered 4 year old, with the right type of personality – it was just too many ifs to go into detail within the post. There are always exceptions, but in general -what’s that saying? Green with green = black and blue? lol

    • I agree – it does depend on the horse. I have owned more than one “bomb proof” – or damn close – three year old that were safe for anyone. When I say safe, I mean that they did not ever, no matter the provocation, buck or spook or rear or bolt. I do not mean that they were finished horses under saddle. These are 2 different issues. A horse can never get well broke at all but still be safe because it just doesn’t have a lot of inclination to act up. Poke Along, rescued last fall, is a good example. She is a 19 year old OTTB, knows nothing, but she hasn’t ever displayed any bad behavior under saddle. I could put a beginner on her, especially in the round pen or on the longe to trot around and practice posting, and never have a fear that she would do something to offload them. But she’s just now starting to learn to canter in a way that doesn’t resemble a buffalo that has been startled by an intercontinental train. So, safe but not at all broke.

      • Oh, I bond with THAT! 11 year old TB gelding who wasn’t even track broke, started last year…

        His canter does indeed resemble a buffalo that has been startled by an intercontinental train…although it’s slowly getting better. I’d actually love some tips on both improving his canter and doing something about the random bucks he’s been giving me lately. I only know it’s not a physical problem…but I can’t find a pattern to when he bucks at the canter (usually on the transition) and when he doesn’t, which is making it really hard to fix.

        Sigh.

      • “…starting to learn to canter in a way that doesn’t resemble a buffalo that has been startled by an intercontinental train.”

        So much love for that description!

  5. Good Gawd.

    IMO, this is a young horse with very very bad leadership and in the right hands would make a great horse with a little time.

    I yelped for the poor girl when that woman cinched her up so tight. The force behind those yanks must have been very painful. Bless that mare for not biting that woman.

    The lunging was horrific (and yes she seemed off a bit, could have been the tight circles).Did anyone notice the loud and clear body language of the so-called-trainer was just screaming “why yes, please by all means step into my space and be the one in charge”. And what’s up with waiting a zillion years for the horses response to backing or changing direction? Green “trainer” for sure and that horse knows it!

  6. That video made my brain bleed. So much wrong…

  7. I think the horse might be ok for an ‘advanced’ beginner – she certainly put up with a lot of crap in the video. The person ‘working’ her looks like an ‘advanced’ beginner to me.
    With the number of starving and abused horses around today I really can’t get too upset about a whole bunch of stupid stuff done with a tolerant horse.
    I board in a barn with 100 horses and probably half of them are handled and ridden in more unsafe and pointless ways than this.
    They are all being fed and not dumped at the local kill auction.

  8. OT, but what is wrong with this filly’s conformation? I’m not great with conformation, but something (or things) seems off. Any ideas?

      • And spelling :”) :”)

        • I’m guessing she’s still doing her baby “see-saw” thing: growing so fast her butt is taller than her withers, then her withers are taller than her butt a few weeks later. Makes them look downhill or uphill…my two babies I raised looked like that at that age and I was worried they’d be “weird” but they both evened out eventually and aren’t bad now as adult horses.
          She’s got some flaws, but she is cute and probably will eventually make a great 4H or trail riding horse.

          • Forgot this: At least the seller got her cleaned up, put a pretty halter on her and has her in nice footing with several shots of her for their ad…
            Registration isn’t important, but her not being registered at 3 years would mean the new owner (if they REALLY wanted to get her registered) would have to fork out about $1000 to get her registered. When I registered my BS Paint, I had to really rush to get it done before her one year birthday to not have to pay out the nose…and that was back in 2000! I can’t imagine what it would cost today.

      • She has a very short neck and a very small head, and a relatively large rear. Makes her look a little wonky (real conformation term, i swear!)

  9. Not nitpicking this one as I’ve seen alot of nice horses come out of small “backyard” trainers. But those were good, knowledgeable folks who really worked hard to get to know their stuff. I see some problems, but nothing a new owner (assuming they are experienced) couldn’t fix pretty easily. At least it looks like she had a fairly good start and wasn’t totally ruined for a future owner! I definately have seen alot worse “trainers” too! I sure wouldn’t sell this sweet tempered mare to a beginniner though! And her price is pretty high….I might go look at her (if I was in the market for a trail horse and close enough) if she was maybe $800 tops. I do have a pet peeve of dragging your cinch through the dirt though! I might have been more forgiving if it had been on grass, but not checking it for debris and not brushing it off before cinching up is a big no-no in my book! Especially those fleece ones! And about tightening the cinch….well…some folks yank outwards with their whole body weight behind it. Being a western rider all my life I’ve learned over the years that tugging….not yanking…upwards on the latigo in small, close tugs is much better and is more comfortable for the horse than jerking at the end of it with a long, far out, put-your-body-weight-behind-it yank. Your horse shouldn’t stagger towards you in a side step when you tighten your cinch because you are pulling him/her off balance. Also I’ve never been a fan of just buckling a western cinch. Some folks are, but it’s just how I am. I’ve seen too many who’s saddles have slipped because of buckling that wasn’t quite tight enough. I “tie-off” because then I can just reach down under my leg and pull the latigo tighter if needed without trying to find a hole to buckle it. And I too am not understanding why the horse has on a shanked bit. I always started my horses in a bosel and then a regular O-ring snaffle or at the most a full cheek snaffle. Direct reining a western type shanked (looks like a tom thumb or a curb type…can’t tell) bit is pretty pointless as it confuses the horse even more. Shanked bits…in my opinion…..are for neck reining. Overall though I think the mare would make a nice trail horse if she goes to someone who has the knowledge to fine tune her. Definately not a advanced beginner horse, but I’d say more of an intermediate rider.

  10. @ Rachel I’d be curious for a more experienced opinion too. I’m really just learning about conformation, so maybe someone else can critique my thoughts here: she seems to be down hill, maybe a bit camped out in the back, does not have the world’s greatest shoulder, and her neck might tie in a bit low. I would guess that she’ll look a bit better when she finishes growing and puts on some muscle. Of course, they don’t specify a breed or discipline, so I could be looking for all the wrong features…Again, I’m very much so still learning about conformation, so by all means correct my observations.

  11. she is a very cute mustang, that looks to have a nice personality. If matched with the RIGHT beginner and training program, there is definetly potential. BUT $2300- you have got to be kidding me. A mustang has to be pretty damn broke to command that kinda cash…the demand just isnt there for these horses..

  12. Ok first of all the (trainer/rider) looks like she has no clue.. Bounceing in the saddle nice lets make her back sore.. Did anyone notice there was no freeze brand like all other BLM mustangs have and I thought if you wanted to sell your mustang the BLM had to be notified. This is all wrong.. She could come live with me and I’d love to work with her the right way.. Oh yea if she’s a BLM mustang don’t see how she has to be taught to cross water.

  13. good point about no brand, although it is possible that maybe shes still wooly enough for it not to be visible. After a year you own the horse, and there are sooo many mustangs needing adoption that the BLM probably wouldnt care if you didnt followup on paperwork transfer.ALthough paperwork is a must if you sell through any kind of an auction. I considered adopting when i lived in nebraska and had the facilities to be able to adopt, and they didnt even care to come out. i just had to make a drawing of my pens.

  14. That whole commentary is a bit too snarky, me thinks. It is a nice looking mustang mare, willing to try to do what is asked. she looks well cared for. Not everyone is a top shelf trainer, but the mare looks to have been gentled nicely. I own a BLM yearling and it takes a fair amount of work to get them where that mare is.

  15. Ugg. First I hate, hate that turn in and face the handler crap. I had to undo all that with my mustang mare. The handler is pretty rude with the girthing too. Uck and she has that pressure on the bit turn going on. That’s a NH thing I don’t like. People don’t understand it and over do it. This is how a horse turns when it is over done. I wonder if this lady had my mare at one point. I like the mare though. Easy fixes and she looks opened to learning. I also have a thing for buckskin/dun too.

    The lunging sucks, the girthing sucks, the riding is mediocre at best and the mare is what I would consider green to saddle. Definitely not a beginning horse though. Just because a horse may not be overtly dangerous does not make said horse good for beginners. As far as a sales video, it sucks too. The quality is poor all around for a $2500 asking price. For that they should find someone with a better camera then take the video at an earlier time of day (less riding through distracting shadows from the trees).

    The price though, not from what I saw. I bought my fully trained, breed to the hilt, dun AQHA mare for that.

    • Oh so that was what that yanking on the mare’s head was about. No wonder the mare is confused with turning, I was confused with what that rider was trying to accomplish too. Not to mention that the rider wouldn’t even do proper circles (I kept hearing my trainer’s voice while watching this saying: “I asked for a circle, not an egg!!”).

      I was impressed at her ground manners, though. I know a few 4 year olds with full training in W/T/C that would definitely not stand quietly like that for a rider that was not experienced. She could have easily tried to run over the handle while she was being lunged, too.

      I wonder why she was never made to canter in the video. I suspect that she might not look so bomb proof when she canters.

  16. She isn’t a normal run of the mill mustang guys. That conformation, color and bone density SCREAMS KIGER! She is actually well put together. Unfortunately she’s in the wrong hands, but puts up with a lot. And the $2300 price tag goes along the lines of a Kiger bred stang. If she catches the right person’s attention they will pay that much. No bones about it. And to have an idiot handling her, she’s a damn good little horse. I know for a fact my 12yr Kiger gelding wouldn’t put up with that crap. He’s still getting use to domesticated living. But I think she has the right personality for an advanced beginner. Grant it let’s hope they seek the help of an experienced horse person after they buy this gal. She needs someone who’s a better leader than the “trainer”. Within a day I was riding two handed easily on my NV mustang stud after I got him. But she looks like she’ll be a good girl. Don’t go judging so quick because of what the trainer is doing and how the mare is acting. From the looks of it this wasn’t a “tune-up”, this was the mare going into training.

    And that brand should be visible by now. My NV boy’s shows up in the wooly months as does my Kiger’s. My Kiger is the same color as this gal and she’s NOT a buckskin, she’s a DUN. Trainer needs to learn her damn colors. I saw some white but the video was stopping constantly. It’s up high on her neck. Also she shouldn’t need shoes with the hoof walls she’s got. Kigers are well known for having very thick hoof walls which is great. I just hate it that whoever the dumbass was that cut her tail and mane. She BARELY has a forelock! BAH! Those are my MAJOR pet peeves because a horse has those there for a REASON! Stupid dumbasses who don’t deserve horses. But those are my views on the mare. And I agree with Snarky, keep the fancy camera work for the pros. This is a video to help sell your horse, not to make a movie out of.

    • It says under the one say video that she IS a Kiger. Which does make her price tag seem a little more justified. (Though I still don’t get why Kigers are more expensive…) They also list her brand number in the video description. 😉 Maybe someone can look it up?

  17. I agree, looks more draft than anything. I’d guess QH/Perch cross. But besides…

    a 4yo mare is GREAT for a beginner! I always cinch my horse with the intent of pulling it off it’s feet & lounge on a 6′ lead rope. Whatcha talkin bout?

    The horse is not so bad, but the dummy selling her wanted to appeal to a larger crowd. Remove the word “beginner intermediate” and ad would be ok, minus the crappy handling

  18. I’d rather see this then what I ran across yesterday on CL in my area. I seen a 10 MONTH OLD FILLY that was broke to ride and they let their 3 YEAR OLD train and ride her down highways and on trials all by herself. And let other kids ride her. They said she also rode in a bit or halter. Email me for screen shot of the ad and another pic of it being rode.

  19. Is it me or does it look like Blossom has a sheath at some points? I also want to applaud the AWESOME enviorment that Blossom is in. Kudos to the dog off the leash. Lunging on a short line (to me it looks like there is no excess in that rope) is super-duper. Imagine if Blossom spooks and pulls the lunge line out of the “trainer’s” hand? There isn’t a round pen or arena to stop her from running. It looks like there is a highway or busy roadway beyond those trees. Horse pancake anyone?

    She is a cute mare and seems pretty tolerant. But in no way is she an advanced/intermediate beginner horse.

  20. She actually looks like a cute mare. Not beginer material at the moment, but in the right hands I think she would make a really nice horse. I hope someone gives her an upgrade. And the girthing, for effs sake! I have seen some cowboys pull a girth up a little rough before but that was utterly ass ridiculous! That poor horse.

  21. My biggest pet peeve about this video was when this women bridled the horse with the reins on the ground.

    Okay, all problems aside, if this horse is really a BLM mustang, it might be worth $2,300 as an endurance prospect. Her mind alone could be worth that.

  22. Snark, should I really put my input on here? I don’t really want to judge the horse as who knows what she might turn into, right now I don’t see anything worth more than the what ever the price per pound is. Even if she is a fairly nice minded mare Someone ( read expensive Pro) is going to have to Undo all the Super-Crap behavior modification the girl in the video did.
    That wasn’t even longing. It was chasing a horse around on a long lead line until it has had enough and when you pull on it’s halter to try to slow it down it turn in to face you. That is All that was, what a crock of ka-ka. That has to be undone now. Whom ever this “trainer” is is so clueless they have not figured out how to get a horse to longe 1 correct circle on a Longe Line. You can predict the rest.
    I’m possitive this mare is a cold blooded drafty cross. No other breed, well maybe a Walker, would have put up with that Crap-tastic display of equestrian FAIL. I feel badly for the girl whom may be the “trainer’s” student. She just may not know what shit this is. The girl who is trying to sell the horse to a beginner however is digging herself into a very deep deep hole.

  23. I have no real complaints about the horse, other than it’s less than steller head. Those tight circles and flashing shadows from the trees onto the horse, makes watching the video dizzying. I found myself watching the photographer’s shadow more than the horse. I would assume that said trainer hooked up with a newbie and told her, after a $200 evaluation of her horse, she would “market” it for her – while also making a tidy profit as the agent – hence the inflated price. Here’s a hint, any time a “trainer” lunges your horse on a longish lead rope for your marketing video, they probably aren’t much of a trainer, or agent. Or, they don’t trust the horse on a longer line. And, if they are trail riding your horse, when they are still working on getting your horse to “go left and right”, I’d be a bit worried. I think I’d want that down well, BEFORE going out on the trails. Another red flag, if the trainer can’t train their own dog to stay out of the way, how can they train a horse?

  24. Oh joy, they not only breed horses but dogs too!
    http://leonsboxersandqueenslands.weebly.com/

    • ow ow ow. Now my whole brain hurts….

      SERIOUSLY? You breed “AGILITY” Boxers… YET NONE OF THE PARENTS HAVE DONE AGILITY….
      I swear, she probably asked them to jump over a stick once and claimed they were agility dogs.

      You breed “CATTLE HERDING” heelers, but I have a feeling neither of those dogs have ever seen a cow before… Not to mention they are horrid example of a “purebred” cattle dog. I see rescue cattle dogs from shelters all the time that look more like the ACD standard than her dogs.

      I’m sure there’s no prcd or BAER testing done on the ACDs… but hey, the don’t really look like purebreds anyway, so why bother? *snark*

      • You just had to make me go look at that, didn’t you… Yes, they have “puppie’s” there along with the “horse’s!” STUPID. That woman can’t ride OR train to save her life and I hate to think of what her idea of a good dog and horse breeding program consists of. I’m sure her horse training is dirt cheap, and by golly, you get what you pay for.

        No arena? No problem. We’ll just trailer your horse over to the park where there’s a handy low-hanging branch to tie her to (What? It’s perfectly safe!), other trees that I can run her into to stop her, no fence, circular or otherwise to help teach her boundaries/bending, and oh yeah, I’ll be sure to bring my lame dog along while I’m at it. Watch how I slouch like a sack of potatoes in the saddle, it’s a really effective seat!

        I think the mare has a lot of potential and her head is so ugly it’s cute. I hope someone with at least half a clue (which beats the current owner and “trainer” put together) makes a nice little mount out of her.

  25. Is anyone else having a really hard time figuring out if the rider is a man or a woman? Either way, that person has an incredibly odd shape and I could not, for the life of me, pay as much attention to the horse as I should have been able to… Those legs do not belong on that body. And the ponytail thing didn’t help me figure out what that person is… and I am so confused. Gah.

    I noticed that the horse is in a curb or a tom thumb type bit? Maybe they should have her in a snaffle until she learns “left and right” well enough o.O

  26. The worst part of this video is that someone PAID this person for training! The woman in the video is just another “certified” Natural Horsmanshit trainer. I have many graduates from the Full O’ Shit University of horse training in my area screwing up horses while picking the pockets of people who have no clue. Now when I get a NH horse for training I charge double because I have to fix all the hack training before we can begin.

  27. Was that supposed to be natural horsemanship training because that doesnt look like any training Ive ever seen or done by any natural horsemanship trainers or other trainers for that matter. I cant figure out what she is trying to acomplish by yanking the horses head while “lunging” her. Was that a horrible attempt at join up or something? I dont see how its helping. This “trainers” body language is all wrong ! And seriously, why are you “training” in a park ? And her lunge line is way to short, i believe my lunge line is thirty feet long.. just saying. Also I think only one other person commented on the fact that ahe drags her cinch through the dirt ! She sisnt wipe it off or anything! There are alot of things wrong with this video that have allready been mentioned. I do hope this horse finds a good home that knows what there doing.
    Also, I saw some people saying she was a Kiger Mustang which would deffinetly up her price but Im still unsure if she should be sold for that much.
    On a side note, I do belive I saw a dorsal stripe on that horse which would make it a dun would it not?

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